Aquamist System Installed

[Sspreso]

Well it took a couple days and hitting up DIY Dave's in Olathe, but the water/methanol injection system is installed. So far no issues. The JCW seems to love it. Eventually will tune for it, but knowing I've stopped the carbon buildup issue dead is enough for now. Anyone thinking about doing this feel free to hit me up with questions.

-John

[Minidave]

Maybe some pics and a link to the product website?

Do you run regular water, distilled water or some sort of methanol mix? Where did you mount the tank? Is it adjustable for flow, or preset? Is it boost dependant?

I assume how quickly it runs thru the reservoir is directly dependant on your right foot?

Given that, what's their estimate of how long a charge should last under "normal" conditions?

Lastly, when are you gonna bring that bad boy out to Heartland Park and give it a real run?

[Sspreso]

Oh you mean actually useful information Dave! I just wanted to brag!:D

I picked up the latest HFS-4 system from Jeff at Howertonengineering. He's putting these Mini specific systems out for at least 2 years, and doing WMI for years longer.
http://www.howertonengineering.net/copy ... ding-tank/
Plus if you have any issues during install Jeff gladly takes your calls.

I run a mix of distilled water and pure methanol (from Buzz's Muffler in KCK). 50/50 and 25/75 are common. Test in the 75% mix now. In a pinch you can run no-additive windshield washer fluid. It's usually a 60/40 blend. I'm not tuning for it yet, but the BMW based ECU does some great self adjustment for the higher octane and cooler IATs.

I mounted the tank in the trunk. Jeff's Mini kit has a tank+pump+mount assembly designed for our cars. The biggest trick was getting the under-cladding off so I could run the lines forward. You get 30 page instructions that cover everything with pics.

The system is uber-adjustable. You wire it up to both IDC and MAP(Boost) so it can trigger either way. Most running the HFS-3 use MAP, but the new HSF-4 is supposed to do IDC better so that is what I'm running now. Further calibration can be done via a THRESHOLD(comes on sooner) and GAIN(stays on longer) adjustments.

And yes the more you are in boost the more the pump runs. It is fairly loud, but only runs when it's spraying. Don't need a boost gauge now

You can dial it down and easily get 3-4 tanks of gas to a tank of mix. My heavier foot and more aggressive settings I'm seeing about 2 tanks of gas to 1 tank of mix. So 5 gallons of methanol should last me 2 months, maybe 3. $20 for 5 gallons. $1 a gallon for the water.

Need to get HPT to move to the 3rd Wednesday of the month. From May thru August I travel fro business the 2nd week of the month. Do they have tech inspections? I just found out that the system is going to cause issues with running SOLO autocross. I'm hoping to get them to let me just run is 100% water which is allowed under SP class.



Pictures are coming. Posted from iPad and uploading and linking pics is a PITA with it.

[Minidave]

Crikeys, $1100!

Where does it port into, and is there just one injector? Are you sure you get even distribution among the cylinders?

I assume it ports in just after the turbo?

I don't know how this would be a lot of help on an autocross, most of the runs I've been on are so short, you can't get all the power of a stock car down. But it will keep your cylinders clean!

[Counterfit_Mini]

Stupid question but what does the meth kit do? I've heard a lot of people talk about but no one has ever explained the point....

[Minidave]

It spray's a water/alcohol mix into the intake to cool the charge, allowing you to run more boost and more timing and make more power.

[Sspreso]

Yeah not cheap, but it's the only system designed for DI engines in particular and been ran on Mini's for years. Besides, over the lifetime of the motor, it works out. Now if the car had 90k miles on it...harder to justify. I could have spent the $1000 on an AccessPort to turn up the boost, or $1000 for turbo back exhaust, or $1000 for FMIC and CAI, but all those potentially stress the motor more. This actually helps the motor and will allow the other items to eventually run without near the stress.

I tapped into the plastic pipe that has the IAT sensor that then runs to the throttle body. Those running the system on larger engines (same system works on v10 BMWs) run 2-3-4 nozzles. Some also run one right after the turbo, then another right before the IAT. But with a 1.6L you actually have to be careful not to snuff out the combustion with too much spray.

As for distribution, the port placement ensures plenty of time for the atomized spray to mix with the charge. Again larger motors are harder to balance distribution out. Mini's run the simplest setup of the HFS.

Yeah not looking for power from the system for autocross, just cooling for hot July/August runs. Also you know, when I upgrade to that M5 in 5 years I can reuse the setup

[Sspreso]

Stupid question but what does the meth kit do? I've heard a lot of people talk about but no one has ever explained the point....

Beyond the 'more boost, more timing, more power' when you run a water mix you are essential steam cleaning the valves when spraying. Some people have installed a WMI hoping to reverse the carbon build up on the motors (30k+ miles), but the results haven't been encouraging there. That said, those who installed the system on fresh clean motors (often rebuilds after blowing the motor) they are not seeing carbon build up when running WMI and a oil catch can.

This is a well documented issue on the N14 motors. Jury's still out on the newer motors having this issue, but I wouldn't be surprised if they too had the problem. Heck there is Mini SA that outlines walnut blast cleaning at 60k for motors with issues. Cost for that...$1200

You can get into a HFS system for closer to $600 if you use your windshield washer tank as a source and run an older controller.

[Punk_Mini]

Jeff Howerton is a pretty freakin cool guy. I wouldn't run windshield washer fluid . When you want to run meth correctly and safely you shouldn't be looking at the money value. Aquamist systems are mindblowing as far as how intelligent the controller on the HFS3 and current HFS4. The failsafes can save you A LOT of money when the tank goes low if you are running a meth tune.

Definitely go to RMW for tuning. That Coupe of yours will be pretty intense when tuned for meth If your good on the track it will be super fast

[Sspreso]

Jeff deserves an award for his level of patience when dealing with people.

I'm sure on a Mini we are only tapping into a small percentage of what this system can do.

Plainville KS? Ha, I grew up south of Hays and wandered north to Plainville on occasion. Can't be too many Mini's out your way.

[Punk_Mini]

Its insane how awesome the Aquamist system works...Jan's GP is currently in fabrication for fitting a Rotrex C38-61 on it...going for 500whp. When he was running the C30-94 on the dyno sitting idling the IAT's got up to around 100* but as soon as he got the car goin on the dyno and when the meth started to spray the IAT's dropped down wayyyyy below ambient which was in the 90's....we are talking 54*F IAT in matter of seconds making a good wholesome 425whp on 21psi on a 1.8L Stroker with 10.5:1 compression. It does even better on the track too.

Here are some pic's Jan's GP at the fabricator
















Wow really you lived out here... Stockton? or further north?

[Sspreso]

I keep hearing you can do some crazy things with the r53s.

Actually I was south of Hays. Old stomping grounds were La Crosse/Liebenthal/Mckracken.

[Minidave]

Did you know Google streetview has been all thru all three of those tiny little Kansas towns?

It's true, you can virtually drive up and down the gravel roads in all of them.....

[Punk_Mini]

The R53 is a pretty stout platform for sure.

Oh right on I got turned around...I have been through Leibenthal and LaCrosse several times goin to Great Bend.

Hehe yeah I saw one of the google cars drive in front of my office when they were collecting 360* pictures

[Sspreso]

Wow, I didn't believe you at first and sure enough there are the sand roads I played on as a kid. A distinct lack of smooth concrete or pavement was the reason we never had skateboards and rollerblades as kids.

[Minidave]

I've had more fun with streetview......especially in other countries, places I'll probably never walk in my life, but I've "been" there....

My brother lives in a tiny village in the English midlands, miles from nowhwere, where the addresses are like "3 Elms, Gronish, Midfordshire " or some such and I found his house - there are 7 buildings in his village fer chri sakes! But streetview had been up the narrow lane where his house is (right across from the pub!) and got a great pic of it!

[Punk_Mini]

Here is a dyno sheet from when Jan broke 400whp with 18psi and different cam and CAI box
it's picking up 80hp between 5000-6000
it's picking up 90hp between 6000-7000
it's picking up 40hp between 7000-7500

[Minidave]

Is this what you're planning to do with your "paperweight" once you hit the big Lotto?

If I'm reading that graph right he's only making 80 hp at 3K, and only 120hp at 4K?

so all the power's up top, just like with a big ol turbo?

[Punk_Mini]

Pretty much but I will only be doing 10:1comp, and C30-94 Rotrex (small one in the picture) C38 is the bigg one

[Punk_Mini]

Is this what you're planning to do with your "paperweight" once you hit the big Lotto?

If I'm reading that graph right he's only making 80 hp at 3K, and only 120hp at 4K?

so all the power's up top, just like with a big ol turbo?

Yeah your correct. The average M45 R53 makes 80-125 3-4k. So its on par with power delivery of the stock SC just 100x more efficient.

The Rotrex is a belt driven turbo so it has the efficiency of a turbo, the response and linear power of a supercharger and none of the lag of a turbo, or heat soak of a conventional (roots and twin screw) SC. Then the biggest and nicest thing is its self-contained so the oil it uses is independent of the engine unlike turbo setups and more importantly has its own oil cooler.

[Minidave]

You must have to overdrive the heck out of it to get any boost, doesn't that need a big ol intercooler too then?

Edit: I went and looked at the site and how they work, in essesnce they have their own overdrive transmission built inot the unit, but it requires a dedicated oil filter, cooler and sump for the fluid. Makes sense now, I wondered how all that would work.

[Punk_Mini]

The oil is a proprietary traction oil and expensive $109 for the quart needed and the filter is $37.50 but you only have to change it ever 50k miles or less if tracked hard.

Here is a picture of the oil loop for the Rotrex. The blue capped can in the area where the ABS module is the sump and then you see the line with the filter goes into the rotrex and then there is another line under that that goes into the oil cooler which in the front of the car and then comes back into the sump.

[Sspreso]

Now don't get me wrong, that linear slope upwards is impressive, but how realistic is it to have the car constantly wrapped up to 5000rpm?
It's like my brothers E85 SRT-4. 400wtq looks impressive, but it hits for only a brief 300 rpm range. His torque curve looks like the paramount logo.